Talk:Ace Ventura: Pet Detective: Difference between revisions

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::::--[[User:KNHaw|<span style="font-family: comic sans ms; color: SeaGreen;">'''''KNHaw'''''</span>]] [[User talk:KNHaw|<span style="color: SeaGreen;"><sup>(talk)</sup></span>]] 19:17, 20 March 2018 (UTC)
::::--[[User:KNHaw|<span style="font-family: comic sans ms; color: SeaGreen;">'''''KNHaw'''''</span>]] [[User talk:KNHaw|<span style="color: SeaGreen;"><sup>(talk)</sup></span>]] 19:17, 20 March 2018 (UTC)

A couple of points about the section as it currently stands (a) I think the section title should be ''Transgender representation'' downplaying the transphobia, because as the sources point out, the film was a product of its time and ''Transgender representation'' is a more neutral term. (b) the first sentence of the section doesn't mention the film making the whole section seem to come from left field, this needs to be tweaked / rearranged. [[User:Stuartyeates|Stuartyeates]] ([[User talk:Stuartyeates|talk]]) 21:21, 20 March 2018 (UTC)

Revision as of 21:22, 20 March 2018

Page move

I request that this page be moved to its correct title. IMDb has it listed under this name, so should we. -- Ianblair23 00:20, 9 August 2005 (UTC)[reply]

It was suggested that this article should be renamed Ace Ventura: Pet Detective. The vote is shown below:

I'm a bit concerned about this move. Does the Wiki software support this sort of move? – AxSkov () 08:11, 18 August 2005 (UTC)[reply]

How do you mean "support"? If you mean "does the Move function allow it directly" (given the existing history at the target page), the answer is "no", but there is a formal process to overcome this inconvenience that also ensures the page history for both articles is recorded for GFDL purposes. I assume that, since it requires some effort, this is why we are supposed to call for a consensus, so sysops doesn't waste their time doing something that will have to be undone later. If you mean "does the Wiki software allow a title with a colon in it that doesn't represent a namespace", the answer is "yes" (see 2001: A Space Odyssey). ~ Jeff Q (talk) 15:56, 18 August 2005 (UTC)[reply]

This article has been renamed after the result of a move request. violet/riga (t) 21:10, 20 August 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Utterly utterly tiny insignificant anal retentive thing, but "It's later learned that Dan Marino was about to be kidnap and join with Snowflake." you missed a "ped" at the end of kidnap.

Removal of Quotes section.

I have decided to be bold and remove the section on Quotes. My reasons for doing so:

  • The list is rather fan-crufty.
  • Those quotes are actually copyrighted.
  • They are of little to absolutely nothing of encyclopedic value.
  • Not written in a formal/encyclopedic style.

If someome has any ideas or suggestions on opposing this, please, by all means, share your thoughts. I thought I'd rather bring this discussion up first before removing it without an explanation. Thank you! Tohru Honda13 07:56, 22 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

If you want to put up quotes, just use wikiquote 68.76.218.65

Jim Carrey and Cannibal Corpse

"Jim Carrey opted to put his favorite band, Cannibal Corpse, into the movie..." While I don't deny the presence of Cannibal Corpse in the movie, is it verifiable that they're Jim Carrey's favorite band and that he "opted" to add them? Lizardking42 08:58, 8 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Yes. he states it in an interview which happens to be quoted on his wikipedia page. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.76.96.112 (talk) 14:17, 3 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Ray Finkle

Hey, I noticed a big problem with the Ray Finkle page. The article makes many false claims about the former Dolphin kicker Ray Finkle. When I clicked on "Discussion" to falsify these claims I was 'redirected' to this page about a fictional character named Ace Ventura. What is going on here? Must we create a new Ray Finkle acticle which lists the facts? Sadly his career ended prematurely in the Super Bowl when Dan Marino messed up in spotting the snap, leaving the laces "in", and thus causing the ball to go wide of the goal-post and the Dolphins lost the Super Bowl. Even this article seems to leave out some of the basics about Finkle's outstanding career. -Soccer style kicker, graduated from Collier High, June 1976, Stetson University Honors Graduate, 1980, former holder of two NCAA records, one for the longest kick, one for the most points in a season, formerlly nicknamed "the mule", the only professional athlete to ever come out of Collier County and one hell of a model American. -Teetotaler


For some reason i thought John Hinckley, Jr. when I saw the movie back in the days. I am not American and did not know who Hinckley was but had heard the name somewhere, and that he was a mental of some sort. Guess that is only a weird coincidence due to the fact that the names sound kind of similar (Fincl vs Hincl). Or? Lebaramebara (talk) 06:54, 9 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Testicle Tuesday

From where did Jim Carey got this phrase? Axxn 19:12, 23 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Ray Finkle article deletion

Is the Ray Finkle article really necessary? Pretty much everything you find on that page is right here and here. Plus, not only that, the character is non-notable. I say we nominate it for deletion. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.34.217.222 (talk) 23:47, 4 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Never mind. I redirected it to this article. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.34.217.222 (talk) 23:24, 5 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Maybe it should be redirected to Scott Norwood? KenFehling (talk) 05:14, 31 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

References

Other Jim Carrey's films make reference to the Ace Ventura films, for instance, there's a scene in Ace Venturs were Jimmy Hoffa is mentioned, and in Bruce all mighty, the find Jimy Hoffa's body. Both Ace and The riddler (played by Carrey) are afraid of Bats. The same species of Ace's monkey Appear in Bruce All Mighty. and the scene in Ace ventura 2 were Ace moves his eyebrows to the beat, he does the same in Irene, Me, and Myself. Should something of this be mentioned in the article?--Fandangox (talk) 03:16, 20 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

vandalism?

I have just reverted the plot description to a previous one as it was a load of foul language and graphic sex description. I can't remember the actual movie but I presume what I have left in does happen - it's not that sexual. btw - it'd been like that since 21st April!?!

Here's what I removed : "So he then rips her skirt off to reveal her penis to everyone and uses the ripped skirt to smack her on her butt. He again fails because although she is wearing panties she clearly appears to have a vagina. Throughout this, Einhorn appears to be shaking a lot, makes some strange faces, has her legs crossed and keeps bobbing slightly. Suddenly Marino who is slightly behind Einhorn calls Ace over and whispers something. As it turns out Einhorn had learned to tuck her penis and testicles between her legs to hide them. The faces she was making where most likely a result of when Ace spanked her with her skirt. He probably hit the tip of her penis and she could not touch it to relieve the pain without maybe drawing attention to it so that was her only outlet. She had crossed her legs to try and squeeze it so no one would notice and the bobbing was an attempt to use her body to pull her penis between her legs and out of sight from both angles. Unfortunately due to the size of it, she is unable to. At one point she makes a very noticeable jerk back. Either way she was unable to hide her penis and"

yeah... how did anyone miss that? 137.205.28.59 (talk) 22:24, 8 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I edited that description a couple of weeks ago to make it look appropriate, and removed all the sleazy descriptions (together with the accompanying poor grammar and spelling). But the author of that unfortunate elaboration seems to have an attachment to this article, and he has since returned and made his edits again. I have now reverted back to my version. Hammondsworth (talk) 08:20, 11 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Billy Cundiff kick in Allusions section

Should this line be in the article? The line "In turn, Billy Cundiff's missed short-range field goal in the 2012 AFC Championship Game was compared to the fictional Finkle kick." doesn't have any citation. Also, no sources other than some tweets and Facebook posts seem to exist. It might be premature to say that the comparison has been made. Also, if such a comparison is made, it wouldn't be something the movie is alluding to, since it happened several years after the movie premiered. 72.173.192.59 (talk) 00:10, 23 January 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Below the "Miami Dolphins" box, but just before the Categories section, I noticed there's a grouping of links, in several languages. In the edit screen, it looks like:

[[ca:Ace Ventura: Pet Detective]]
[[cy:Ace Ventura: Pet Detective]]
[[da:Ace Ventura: Pet Detective]]
[[de:Ace Ventura – Ein tierischer Detektiv]]
[[es:Ace Ventura]]
[[fr:Ace Ventura, détective pour chiens et chats]]
[[gl:Ace Ventura: Pet Detective]]
[[it:Ace Ventura - L'acchiappanimali]]
[[he:אייס ונטורה: בלש בצחוק]]
[[hu:Ace Ventura: Állati nyomozó]]
[[nl:Ace Ventura: Pet Detective]]
[[ja:エース・ベンチュラ]]
[[no:Ace Ventura og jakten på den forsvunne delfinen]]
[[pl:Ace Ventura: Psi detektyw]]
[[pt:Ace Ventura: Pet Detective]]
[[ru:Эйс Вентура: Розыск домашних животных]]
[[sr:Ејс Вентура: Детектив за кућне љубимце]]
[[fi:Ace Ventura – lemmikkidekkari]]
[[sv:Den galopperande detektiven]]
[[tr:Hayvan Dedektifi]]

It looks like this is trying to be a list of links to any Ace Ventura: Pet Detective articles on the Wikipedias of other languages, but they all lead to non-existent articles on the english Wikipedia, instead. Is there a way to correct this? Leogorath (talk) 19:58, 1 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Edit: I moved the links to an earlier point in the article, and it made them appear as normal Interlanguage links. Not sure why they weren't behaving normally before. Leogorath (talk) 20:06, 1 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Transphobic?

I think there should be a discussion of this movies transphobia. Lois Einhorn is a trans woman who is brutally sexually assaulted by Ace, and there is no mention of that in the article. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 58.65.70.36 (talk) 05:29, 1 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Actually Finkle engages in rape by fraud in the movie, so he is the one who sexually assaulted people not the other way around. And obviously someone getting breast implants does not necessarily indicate any kind of trans status. He still has testicles, was never diagnosed with gender dysphoria, and was never granted a legal sex change by the government. You might be unaware of this but many schizophrenic people attempt to have trans treatments done to them. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10226303
Spoken like a true transmisogynist. Trans women are women regardless of surgery, legal status, professional diagnosis, neurodivergence, and every other nitpick you might come up with - if someone tells you she's a woman, she's a woman. It's in absolutely no way "fraud" for a trans woman not to tell someone she's trans, especially not a violent transmisogynist who goes on to assault her. This film is shockingly reactionary in its transmisogyny and incredibly harmful to transfeminine people, and Wikipedia's article should at least acknowledge the issue. 00dani (talk) 00:34, 3 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]
I agree that there should be discussion of transphobia in this article. Many commentators have talked about this, so there are plenty of good articles for sourcing/referencing. The film really is horrendously transphobic: it ends with THE GOOD GUY fucking hazing a trans woman in front of a crowd of cops. When I was a child, I walked away from this film in absolute tears.
And yeah, you can try to make the argument, "Oh, Finkle wasn't really trans! He was just crossdressing as part of a wacky convoluted revenge scheme!" But here's the thing: loads of movies try to get away with transphobic violence by having obviously trans characters be "technically not trans". Remember The Silence Of The Lambs? That movie has done more to cement the "trans people as crazy murderers" image in people's heads than any other in history.
Ace Ventura – Pet Detective is widely considered a transphobic movie by commentators, you can find many good sources supporting this analysis, and I think it should be mentioned in the "Reception" section.
Lionboy-Renae (talk) 17:53, 31 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]
I have been returning to this article periodically to check if anyone had touched upon the blatant transphobia exhibited in the film - as of today (11 January 2018), no one had, so I went ahead and added a subsection under reception to touch upon this. I have also noticed that in the plot description the author of that section intermittently switches pronouns when referring to Lt. Einhorn - I intend to resolve this at a later time (among other grammatical inconsistencies), unless someone else can get to it first.
Ghostsax 16:23, 11 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Ghostsax, BuzzFeed may be challenged by others. I recommend looking up results in Google Books. You can search for "ace ventura" transphobia|transphobic to find results like this. Erik (talk | contrib) (ping me) 16:39, 11 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Erik, thank you for pointing this out, I had kind of figured that it might be. The article that I cited did seem well researched and written, but I will work on finding another one regardless. Ghostsax 16:51, 11 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]

This is why wikipedia is so shitty. This right here. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.138.213.196 (talk) 06:43, 20 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Wikipedia is a space for unbiased encyclopedic information, and this film is objectively transphobic. There's no motive or bias at work here, just plain old historical accuracy. If you don't find that to your liking you might want to reconsider your reasons for being a contributor here (although attempting to remove an entire section out of spite and personal distaste isn't necessarily much of a contribution).
Ghostsax 9:41, 13 March 2018 (UTC)
I've re-removed that section per WP:UNDUE and WP:SYNTH. I suggest you yourself consult WP:CIVIL. Jtrainor (talk) 08:08, 20 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Jtrainor, Meredith Talusan is a BuzzFeed News Reporter, which is different from just any BuzzFeed contributor. The reliability depends on the context of the piece. The Guardian has a description of her: "Meredith Talusan is a transgender writer and photographer based in New York. Her work has appeared in The Nation, The American Prospect, and is upcoming in Vice." Furthermore, the Google Books link I provided above shows that there are additional sources about the topic in this film. Pinging KNHaw as an involved editor. Erik (talk | contrib) (ping me) 16:36, 20 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you for pinging me on this. My original concern was the removal of the section that I saw had no comment referencing discussion on the talk page, making me suspect a vandal edit. That issue is resolving itself as we discuss this here, though.
EDIT: As a personal favor, I ask anyone making edits to this section please be sure to flag a reason and indicate any consensus in the edit comments when you make your changes. Otherwise, it looks a lot like a vandal edit and might get reverted by someone else on vandal patrol. --KNHaw (talk) 20:13, 20 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Weighing in on the merits of this discussion, I remember watching the film years ago and the word "transphobic" literally was not in my vocabulary. Reflecting on it now, though... yeah, the Einhorn character is basically mocked/humiliated for laughs because she is trans. The kidnapping plot is pretty much irrelevant to the characters' reaction after that revelation. She's basically (in the logic of the movie) a sexual predator by nature of being trans. Yes, the notion of rape by fraud/deception in this context and the possibility that she is schizophrenic are both valid and would make a great idea for a movie - but that movie is definitely not Ace Ventura. Einhorn is not arrested for the supposed rapes - instead she's publicly punished in full view of the entire police department. If that isn't singling out her behavior for special punishment, I don't know what is.
I like that the section has multiple sources now. It also clearly labels the opinions of those who feel it is transphobic as opinions. If someone wants to weigh in in the section and make a well sourced counter point (the rape/schizophrenic discussion above might be the foundation of such a counterpoint - taking care not to get into "she deserves humiliation" territory), I think that'd be a great thing to see. But I think the section as it stands should stay. I haven't seen a call for a formal vote on this, but if there is one I vote it should stay.
--KNHaw (talk) 19:17, 20 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]

A couple of points about the section as it currently stands (a) I think the section title should be Transgender representation downplaying the transphobia, because as the sources point out, the film was a product of its time and Transgender representation is a more neutral term. (b) the first sentence of the section doesn't mention the film making the whole section seem to come from left field, this needs to be tweaked / rearranged. Stuartyeates (talk) 21:21, 20 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]