Basil Kilani

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Basil Kilani (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log | edits since nomination)
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Declined prod. Source was added https://www.newspapers.com/article/the-los-angeles-times-liberian-runner-sh/166592209/ which doesn't appear to name this person. Lacking SIGCOV to meet WP:SPORTSCRIT and WP:NOLY. LibStar (talk) 23:07, 24 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Extended content
  • Keep with great respect to the above !voters' views and contributions, this is only a disagreement about policy. I do believe in using WP:NEXIST very sparingly, meaning I don't think it applies to 99%+ of articles on-wiki. But the simple fact is that that Kilani is a clear case where it applies:
    1. . Is there enough WP:V content on Kilani to construct a stub? Yes, the article as written only consists of verified content from WP:RS. So the only issue is notability, not verifiability.
    2. . Has Kilani done something that would indicate coverage exists? Yes, Kilani was the best long-distance track runner from his country of millions of people in the 1970s, as evidenced by the fact that he was the only such Jordanian athlete to qualify for the 1984 Olympics. Standards of achievement for athletics have always been specific to regions and sub-groups and not only universal. Of course a universal standard also exists, but for the same reason Sherman Guity is notable despite "pedestrian" sprint times, what matters is not whether Kilani did or WP:DIDNOTWIN but whether he was notable for his accomplishments in a large enough sub-group.
    3. . Have we searched relevant archives? Do we even have access to them? This is a resounding no. We know that newspapers and periodicals were widespread in Jordan at the time. But where are the archives? A good start would be searching under the subject's native name Arabic: باسل كيلاني. Once we have those archives, it shouldn't take much, we'd expect coverage from the Olympics to exist on the first sports or news page on the day of Kilani's competitions. But we don't.
Lastly I'll just say that there is a wording issue in the nominating statement, of course "which doesn't appear to name this person" is incorrect because the subject is mentioned in the first sentence of the article. Yes, it's only a mention, meaning it serves to fulfill WP:V but not WP:N – hence why NEXIST is necessary here. --Habst (talk) 17:07, 25 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]
But we still have no sources, "Trust me some exist" isn't enough. Oaktree b (talk) 20:52, 25 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]
@Oaktree b, I have great respect for your edits, but I think you are falling trap to a common misconception about Wikipedia P&G – yes, NEXISTS can be invoked without a specific URL or page number of a citation, and there is some responsibility to search for sources before deletion even if they aren't readily available online. See the closing admin comment at WP:Articles for deletion/Maher Abbas: ... I'm not typically impressed by the "there must be sources" genre of argument, BeanieFan11's is unusually solid: it is true that not a single participant has reported searching Lebanese newspapers (where we'd expect to find the most coverage) and finding nothing. Those points all also apply to this AfD.
A lot of people think that if you look for sources online and can't find any, that's sufficient grounds to delete an article. And in 99% of cases that may be true, but Wikipedia P&G are more nuanced than that. --Habst (talk) 21:06, 25 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]
I'm an inclusionist, but without proper sourcing, we can't presume anything. This individual is most certainly notable, but we have nothing to prove that notability. The best source for media in that part of the world that we can access would be the BnF Gallica, simply for the shared language, [2] but there are no sources to be found. A Lebanese athlete would get some mention in the Francophone press if they were this notable, but there isn't any. Oaktree b (talk) 21:15, 25 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]
Abbas was Lebanese but Kilani (this AfD subject) is Jordanian, so I don't think a French newspaper would suffice. List of newspapers in Jordan would be a good start – those in the table that would have existed during Kilani's prime would be The Jordan Times, Al Liwaa, Al Ra'i, and Ad-Dustour. To my knowledge, although we know that they existed in the 80s, none have searchable archives from that time, meaning we would need to do some digging like finding old issues. --Habst (talk) 21:31, 25 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Basil Al-Kilani, the athlete

1 The unknown who did not participate in the tournament A year ago, he did not have a share 7 0 of the competitions that 0 .. Igham since a year for the national electors after he insisted on continuing training. With determination and deliberation .. until he surprised everyone and the champions

The previous one on the track, so Khalil

And Ham to the constellation in the 00.0 km race And the situation worsened with him, so he finished third, and I think Some people thought it was a stroke of luck, but he confirmed 0 The second day of the tournament 3 His ability to follow 0 The champions in the 101 km race, and he almost 3 won it if it were not for his lack of resourcefulness and experience He finished second and is now developing

5 An organized development.

Student Basil Kilani: One of the champions of the cross-country race

What are the impressions that.

Bear about the sports movement inside the college

He said at the beginning of the year there was no extra interest in athletes and the dean of the college promised that there were privileges for athletes and that they would be exempted from some of the fees or reduced, but one day we were surprised by the dean’s registrar taking us out of the classes and demanding that we pay the full fee.

There was one teacher in the college, which was not enough to train the teams, but finally the college received two sports coaches who led the teams to victory and the college director became the first supporter of sports and athletes

In response to what was reported by sports circles and newspapers about our athletics team that represented Jordan in the Los Angeles Olympics, I would like to present a clearer and more detailed picture of this drowned(?) person ... Basil Kilani competed in the 1000[0]m race. He achieved Al-Kilani set a new Jordanian record in the 30.42 1000[0]m race, completing the distance in 30 minutes, thus breaking his previous record of 32.02 minutes by one minute and twenty seconds.

An hour. He came in fifteenth place with a time of 19/2014 and there are many like him ... This is an achievement in a short period of time that is almost unexpected. He participated in the 5000m race, which started at a speed higher than what is required for our player, and he covered the first kilometer in 2.47 minutes and the second kilometer in 2.44 minutes, which is close to his maximum speed time, which was a technical mistake for the player, and thus he lost his record achieved in Germany by 15 seconds.

...

However, we must take into consideration all aspects of the shortage in numbers and capabilities, from technical and other aspects, so that we can achieve better accomplishments in the future...

huge blockquote redacted somewhat by asilvering (talk) 00:42, 3 March 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Dclemens1971 (talk) 14:51, 4 March 2025 (UTC)[reply]
Allikas: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Basil_Kilani
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