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A lot of Western reporting on Palestinian organizations as frighteningly incorrect. They have trouble distinguishing between Fatah and PLO, and between PLO and PNA, and between Hamas and its military wings. If Hamas is militant because of its military wings, then so is the State of Israel because of [[IDF]] and [[ANC]] because of [[uMkhonto we Sizwe]]. [[User:ImTheIP|<span style="color:#807">Im</span><span style="color:#870">The</span><span style="color:#087">IP</span>]] ([[User talk:ImTheIP|talk]]) 18:18, 2 October 2020 (UTC)
A lot of Western reporting on Palestinian organizations as frighteningly incorrect. They have trouble distinguishing between Fatah and PLO, and between PLO and PNA, and between Hamas and its military wings. If Hamas is militant because of its military wings, then so is the State of Israel because of [[IDF]] and [[ANC]] because of [[uMkhonto we Sizwe]]. [[User:ImTheIP|<span style="color:#807">Im</span><span style="color:#870">The</span><span style="color:#087">IP</span>]] ([[User talk:ImTheIP|talk]]) 18:18, 2 October 2020 (UTC)
:The state of Israel is a country. Almost all countries have an army. Most political organization don't have military wing. Also, you asked for sources and you got your sources. We have more than enough sources that say that Hamas is a militant organization. You can NOT just dismiss the sources because you don't like what they are saying. You are welcome to bring reliable sources that say that Hamas is not a militant organization. <!-- Template:Unsigned --><small class="autosigned">—&nbsp;Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:ArmorredKnight|ArmorredKnight]] ([[User talk:ArmorredKnight#top|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/ArmorredKnight|contribs]]) 19:42, 2 October 2020 (UTC)</small> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->
:The state of Israel is a country. Almost all countries have an army. Most political organization don't have military wing. Also, you asked for sources and you got your sources. We have more than enough sources that say that Hamas is a militant organization. You can NOT just dismiss the sources because you don't like what they are saying. You are welcome to bring reliable sources that say that Hamas is not a militant organization. <!-- Template:Unsigned --><small class="autosigned">—&nbsp;Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:ArmorredKnight|ArmorredKnight]] ([[User talk:ArmorredKnight#top|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/ArmorredKnight|contribs]]) 19:42, 2 October 2020 (UTC)</small> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

::"Militant" is a fairly mild description and I would not object to it (terrorist organization is worse) although I understand the point the ImTheIP is making about the separate wings a la IRA/Hizbollah. Anyway IRA political wing is now part of government (as is H) and ultimately, I suspect the same sort of thing will happen with Hamas.[[User:Selfstudier|Selfstudier]] ([[User talk:Selfstudier|talk]]) 10:56, 3 October 2020 (UTC)

Revision as of 10:56, 3 October 2020

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Former featured article candidateHamas is a former featured article candidate. Please view the links under Article milestones below to see why the nomination was archived. For older candidates, please check the archive.
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Quotes in citations

As per the discussion on Wikipedia talk:Citing sources/Archive 19#Quotes in references and per WP:COPYVIO I will remove the quotes within the citations. This will also make the article a bit shorter (especially the references section) and easier to edit.

Cheers, pedrito - talk - 04.07.2008 06:18


However, its founding charter, writings, and many of its public statements[7] reflect an incontrovertible evidence of Anti-zionism. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Alhizabr (talk • contribs) 20:32, 2 January 2009

Was Hamas created in 1976, 1986, 1987, 1988?

1976

The Oxford World Encyclopedia: "Hamas¶ The Islamic Resistance Movement founded in 1976 by Sheikh Yassin Ahmed, with the aim of creating an Islamic state in the former Palestine. "

1986:

"Son of Hamas": http://books.google.com/books?id=QFYw0R8S-KMC&lpg=PT282&pg=PT33

1987:

Wikipedia: "Hamas was created in 1987 by Sheikh Ahmed Yassin, Abdel Aziz al-Rantissi and Mohammad Taha of the Palestinian wing of the Muslim Brotherhood at the beginning of the First Intifada."

The Corporate Security Professional's Handbook on Terrorism: "Hamas was a splinter group of the Palestinian branch of the Muslim Brotherhood and was created as a separate organization in 1987."

1988

http://www.ajc.org/atf/cf/%7B42D75369-D582-4380-8395-D25925B85EAF%7D/HAMAS2006.PDF: Hamas is a creation of the Palestinian branch of the extremist Muslim Brotherhood movement. The organization was created in 1988 by the late Sheikh 11 Ahmad Yassin, the Hamas ideologue and founder who was then a preacher of the Palestinian Muslim Brotherhood movement in Gaza. In concurrence with his teachings, Yassin and his followers formed Hamas as the “military wing” of the Palestinian Muslim Brotherhood. 86.68.157.246 (talk) {BG}; edited: 86.68.157.246 (talk) {BG}

—Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.68.157.246 (talk • contribs) 14:55, 4 January 2009

For 1987 I can add that it is mentioned that: 'Hamas was founded in 1987 (during the First Intifada)'. The first intifada started at December 1987 in that case Hamas was established on December 1987, When exactly? Maybe with the first manifest?

Both Filiue [1] and Tamimi [2] give December 14, 1987 as the date for the formal establishment of Hamas. Tamimi claims this was the date for the first communique signed Hamas, although according to Filiue, Hamas was not recognized as the official name for the Islamic resistance movement until February 1988.

  1. ^ "The Origins of Hamas: Militant Legacy or Israeli Tool?". Journal of Palestine Studies. 41 (3): 54–70. 2012. doi:10.1525/jps.2012.XLI.3.54. {{cite journal}}: Unknown parameter |month= ignored (help)
  2. ^ Tamimi, Azzam (2007). Hamas: a history from within ([2nd. ed.] ed.). Northampton, Mass.: Olive Branch. ISBN 978-1566568241.

Gaza Finance section

This at most needs to be boiled down to a few lines. It is scattered tidbits patched together with no synthetic thematic approach.

Gaza domestic funding

Hamas approved a 540-million-dollar government budget for 2010 with up to 90% coming from "undisclosed" foreign aid, which includes funding from Iran and Egypt's Muslim Brotherhood according to western intelligence agencies.[1] Due to the Gaza blockade, Hamas still faces a financial crisis. With a bureaucracy of around 30,000 staff, the organisation is growing faster than can be handled, with salaries being delayed or prioritised for the lowest paid. To fund its budget, Hamas has raised new taxes on businesses and imposed a 14.5% tax on luxury goods smuggled through the tunnels. Gaza businessmen have accused Hamas of profiting from the blockade and using these taxes to buy large tracts of land and private buildings for public facilities in competition to established businesses.[1][2][3]

In August 2011, the U.S State Department threatened to cut 100 million dollars in aid it sends to the Gaza Strip if Hamas continues to insist upon auditing American foreign aid organizations after Hamas suspended operations of the International Medical Corps following the group's refusal to submit to an on-site audit. Most foreign charities submit their own audits to the Interior Ministry in Ramallah. Charities must be audited by law, possibly to ensure money is not diverted for political or intelligence-gathering purposes but as the U.S. government forbids direct contact with Hamas, the action prompted Washington to issue the threat via a third party. Aid provided by American and other foreign groups goes to hundreds of thousands of Palestinians in Gaza, where most of the 1.6 million residents are refugees.[4][5]

A U.S. official based in the region said "USAID-funded partner organizations operating in Gaza are forced by Hamas's actions to suspend their assistance work. (They) were put on hold effective August 12."[6] According to the official, Hamas demanded access to files and records of NGOs, which would reveal financial and administrative information, details of staff members and information on beneficiaries. He said Hamas shut down IMC and USAID after the U.S. objected to "unwarranted audits". Hamas administration official Taher al-Nono said Hamas had a right to monitor their work in the territory but an understanding had been reached that would allow independent auditing teams to inspect the files of NGOs.[7]

A day after the U.S. announced it was suspending financial aid to Gaza, Hamas officials said they had reached an agreement with the United States that would allow USAID to continue operations.[8]

In August 2011, the Hamas government in the Gaza Strip imposed new travel restrictions on Palestinians active in non-governmental organizations by requiring them to provide details of the trip to the ministry in what the Palestinian NGO Network regards as another Hamas attempt to control and hamper them. The Palestinian Center for Human Rights condemned the new laws. Tharut al Bic, head of the interior ministry's NGO department, stated, "the new instructions are intended to make it easier for travellers to better organize their trip and to preserve order." Hamas requires sick people wishing to leave the Gaza Strip to submit applications and meet various conditions, in addition to restrictions Israel imposes on Palestinians leaving Gaza.[9]

In 2014 Fatah accused Hamas of stealing a total of $700 million from aid directed at Gaza Strip reconstruction and civilian casualties of the conflict. In the beginning of October Hamas soldiers raided one of the branches of Bank of Palestine and seized $750'000 in cash. A number of Fatah activists also accused Fatah leadership of organized theft of aid resources.[10]

References

  1. ^ a b Iran punishes Hamas for not backing Assad| August 23, 2011
  2. ^ Hamas imposes new Gaza taxes to pay for burgeoning bureaucracy, The Guardian, by Rory McCarthy.
  3. ^ Eric Cunningham (August 17, 2009). "Hamas profits from Israel's Gaza blockade". Christian Science Monitor. Retrieved August 24, 2010.
  4. ^ Bronner, Ethan (August 11, 2011). "U.S. Threatens to Halt Gaza Aid Over Hamas Audits". The New York Times. Retrieved August 12, 2011.
  5. ^ Miller, David E. (August 11, 2011). "US may cut Gaza aid over Hamas probes". The Jerusalem Post. Retrieved January 6, 2013.
  6. ^ "US suspends work of aid groups in Gaza Strip". Ynetnews.com. 1995-06-20. Retrieved 2014-08-02.
  7. ^ Nidal al-Mughrabi (August 13, 2011). "U.S. suspends work of aid groups in Gaza Strip". Reuters. Retrieved January 6, 2013.
  8. ^ "'Hamas, US reach compromise on Gaza aid'". The Jerusalem Post. August 13, 2011. Retrieved January 6, 2013.
  9. ^ Hass, Amira (August 30, 2011). "Gaza NGOs express 'horror' at new Hamas travel restrictions on Palestinians". Haaretz. Retrieved January 6, 2013.
  10. ^ "Hamas and Fatah Already Fighting Over Gaza Funds". Gatestone Institute. 2014-09-20. Retrieved 2014-10-12.

Hamas truce conditions

From the article lead:

"Analysts have said that it seems clear that Hamas knows that many of its conditions for the truce could never be met."

I don't think the given citation is sufficient to say this. It is a single article written by Michael Herzog, a retired brigadier general in the Israel Defense Forces, the son of the former Israeli president.

I cannot edit the article to remove this sentence as it is protected. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Stormx2 (talk • contribs) 01:00, 9 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Stormx2, I have removed it. I also agree with what you said. Per WP:UNDUE.--SharabSalam (talk) 01:17, 9 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]
SharabSalam, you removed the source with the edit summary that the opinion of an Israeli politician was undue. What Stormx2 said above isn’t true. The article isn’t written by Herzog, it was just written with the feedback of Herzog, who is NOT an “Israeli politician”. His expertise was sought both as a military commander, and more especially, as a peace negotiator. The article is actually by Martin Fletcher, the NBC bureau chief for Middle East Affairs. This is a reliable source, and even falls into “expert opinion”. Furthermore, Fletcher isn’t stating anything revolutionary, or outside mainstream analysis. Which is why the article states this. It’s the general consensus of both experts and the international community that Israel would reject these terms, especially for a cease fire, instead of a long term truce... The article is analysis on what terms would have been feasible, and which ones would be untenable, or even infeasible. Symmachus Auxiliarus (talk) 03:05, 9 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you both! I'll have a look for other analyses of the truce terms if I find time later. Herzog's analysis alone seems insufficient if we're to start a sentence "Analysts have said...". Perhaps if he was dispassionately summing up the views of several other analysts it would work. Stormx2 (talk) 18:30, 9 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Stormx2, no problem. However, once again, that’s not Herzog’s article. The statement you’re referencing is by Fletcher, in journalistic “voice”. The Q&A section obviously incorporates Herzog’s analysis. But yes, it would be better to have more sources bolster such a statement. I don’t think it’s controversial or reasonably disputed by any mainstream sources, though. My main point in posting my original comment is that there seemed to be a fundamental misunderstanding and mischaracterization of the source. I honestly don’t think there’s any policy-based reason for its removal, in addition to the edit summary removing it being inaccurate, and on those grounds it should probably be reverted. Regardless, I’m not opposed to finding alternate or additional sources. Symmachus Auxiliarus (talk) 19:49, 9 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 19 June 2020

Add citation to" He fled to Qatar in 2012 as a result of the Syrian civil war.[citation needed]"


https://time.com/khaled-mashaal/ "Mashaal first moved to Kuwait, where he joined the Muslim Brotherhood at age 15, then earned a physics degree and worked as a teacher. He later moved to Jordan, where he led Hamas’s powerful branch in the country, then to Syria and, in January 2012, fled that country’s civil war for Qatar,"


https://www.reuters.com/article/us-qatar-hamas-meshaal/hamas-denies-exiled-leader-meshaal-expelled-from-qatar-idUSKBN0KF18Y20150106 "Another Hamas source confirmed that Meshaal was still in Doha and has no plans to leave the Gulf Arab country.


Unicameral nado (talk) 22:30, 19 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]
 Done Thank you, I've added the source. Darren-M talk 00:14, 20 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Militant?

Most sources distinguishes between Hamas and it's military wing(s). I.e Hamas itself is not militant. ImTheIP (talk) 05:16, 6 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

The military wing is integral part of Hamas. It is true that Hamas is not only a militant group, but it is also a militant group. so yes, Haamas is a militant organization that carried out many suicide bomb attacks.ArmorredKnight (talk) 15:53, 2 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]
No. Hamas is organized similarly to Batasuna and Sinn Féin was. And it is, as always, the side making the claim (in this case that Hamas is militant) that has to provide sources. ImTheIP (talk) 16:11, 2 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]
I don't know about the Sinn Féin, but the military wing is integral part of Hamas and as such it is a militant organization. From what I know almost 40% of its budget go to militant activity.
Also there are many sources that says Hamas is militant organization here are some:
https://www.britannica.com/topic/Hamas "militant Islamic Palestinian nationalist "
https://www.haaretz.com/misc/tags/TAG-hamas-1.5598922 "Hamas is a militant and political Islamist group"
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/middle_east/israel-says-it-arrested-hamas-militant-who-fled-strip-by-sea/2020/07/30/8fe7162c-d273-11ea-826b-cc394d824e35_story.html
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-13331522 Hamas is the largest of several Palestinian militant Islamist groups.
since the sources are saying that Hamas is a militant group, we can safely put it in the article. After all debate about facts should be decide according the sources. If you have reliable sources that say that Hamas is not militant organization, we can talk about it. — Preceding unsigned comment added by ArmorredKnight (talk • contribs) 16:23, 2 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

someone should please put back the militant in the article. ImTheIP removed it even thought there are sources that support it is militant. — Preceding unsigned comment added by ArmorredKnight (talk • contribs) 16:26, 2 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

A lot of Western reporting on Palestinian organizations as frighteningly incorrect. They have trouble distinguishing between Fatah and PLO, and between PLO and PNA, and between Hamas and its military wings. If Hamas is militant because of its military wings, then so is the State of Israel because of IDF and ANC because of uMkhonto we Sizwe. ImTheIP (talk) 18:18, 2 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

The state of Israel is a country. Almost all countries have an army. Most political organization don't have military wing. Also, you asked for sources and you got your sources. We have more than enough sources that say that Hamas is a militant organization. You can NOT just dismiss the sources because you don't like what they are saying. You are welcome to bring reliable sources that say that Hamas is not a militant organization. — Preceding unsigned comment added by ArmorredKnight (talk • contribs) 19:42, 2 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]
"Militant" is a fairly mild description and I would not object to it (terrorist organization is worse) although I understand the point the ImTheIP is making about the separate wings a la IRA/Hizbollah. Anyway IRA political wing is now part of government (as is H) and ultimately, I suspect the same sort of thing will happen with Hamas.Selfstudier (talk) 10:56, 3 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]
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