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In a previous section it was mentioned that the AANES changed its official name to the DAANES (D for Democratic). And it has seen usage from media too (such has this https://hawarnews.com/en/daa-calls-on-un-to-provide-support-for-displaced-people). I suggest those that can edit the page do so with the new added word Remikipedia (talk) 05:33, 4 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I think we should go further and move the article to Democratic Autonomous Administration of North and East Syria. Charles Essie (talk) 21:41, 9 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Entirely agree

• Both Constitution of the Autonomous Administration of North and East Syria and Human rights in the AANES were moved, I haven't found any others but feel free to ping me if you do. ASUKITE 15:37, 23 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

The link to the main article in the 'External relations' section should be to 'AANES–Ba'athist Syria relations' rather than to 'Rojava–Syria relations', to reflect the article's current title. Hexalogical (talk) 16:37, 9 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

 Done Ultraodan (talk) 13:49, 29 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The head of the al-Hasakah Elders Council, Akram Mahshoush as of 18 Jan 2025, is apparently one of the few people in English-language WP:RS who has recently stated what's going on in terms of HTS-transitional-govt negotiations with AANES,^[1] but in this particular article (AANES), I don't see any indication of the relation of Elders Councils with other structures. It would be good to have some info about this, either here or, I guess, in Jazira Region. Boud (talk) 23:29, 18 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Is there a reason that ANNES is still the acronym used across the article? Shouldn't it be DANNES per the name change? Charles Essie (talk) 01:10, 24 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

It should indeed be DANNES per the move. I've cleaned up use and some surrounding textual issues (settling on just "DAANES" rather than "the DAANES" consistently). However, I left uses of AANES where the context is before 2023, and the official website is still https://aanesgov.org/. CMD (talk) 02:09, 24 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

In the Background part of the History section, there is the line "It was then part of Assyria, with the last surviving Assyrian imperial records, from between 604 BC and 599 BC, were found in and around the Assyrian city of Dūr-Katlimmu." The grammar is a bit off, the "were" should be removed, or replaced with "being." Shredlordsupreme (talk) 17:05, 31 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

•  Done. Thanks for pointing it out. Aviationwikiflight (talk) 08:34, 22 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]

The introductory text is the most important part of an article simply because that's what'll be read the most.

I note that the following sentence is in the article: "The region's administration has also been accused by partisan and non-partisan sources of authoritarianism, media censorship, forced disappearances, support of the Ba'athist regime, Kurdification, and displacement."

The 'Kurdification' section has no source and the next citation is a UN report that explicitly clears (or, at the very least, finds no evidence of) ethnic cleansing or even discrimination on ethnic grounds by the SDF. And I quote:

"93. Though allegations of “ethnic cleansing” continued to be received during the period under review, the Commission found no evidence to substantiate claims that YPG or SDF forces ever targeted Arab communities on the basis of ethnicity, nor that YPG cantonal authorities systematically sought to change the demographic composition of territories under their control through the commission of violations directed against any particular ethnic group."

While there has thus been the 'accusation' of Kurdification, it seems that there is no significant evidence that there has been any attempt to engineer a demographic displacement or to enact displacements *on an ethnic basis*. Although it is not technically inaccurate to say there has been an accusation, I feel it is misleading to say that this particular claim has the same level of credence as those that surround it (e.g., displacement on non-ethnic grounds, which is unambiguously true and accepted by all sources-and not even denied by the AANES/SDF itself, who naturally claim it is borne from military necessity). When we write these accusations in the introductory section of the article without rebutting them when they are without a factual basis, it falsely gives a level of credibility to the claims that, in truth, do not exist. This is especially true when the most forceful claim comes from the Turkish Government, and the second comes from a source which seems to be down at the moment (the article in question was never archived) and may well have been down for quite some time. The only serious claim thus comes from Amnesty, but I think it is fair to say that the allegations of Kurdification/ethnic cleansing themselves have been largely rebutted by non-partisan, authoritative bodies (namely, the UN). No serious claims from authoritative, non-partisan sources have been made since that one singular Amnesty article, all the way back in 2015, which has since been found to be false.

I mean any group or polity will have some sort of frivolous claims against them, and I don't think they need to be included in the article heading if they're without a strong factual basis. To use a slightly more extreme/obvious example, we wouldn't write "Jewish people have been accused of controlling all the banks" or whatever on the introduction to the 'Jewish People' page, even if some Nazis say that. The general principle remains the same: unsupported "allegations" simply should not have this place in an article. For more contentious things where there are arguments both ways (e.g., forced disappearances) it's perhaps a bit more reasonable, but Kurdification (that is, ethnic cleansing and/or demographic re-engineering) is completely baseless.

Honestly I'd say the same for the whole thing about siding with the Ba'athists, but that's for another discussion.

As such, I think I am inclined to remove this word as it discredits the article any more than other discredited conspiracies would on other articles if they were taken seriously in the introduction. I wont do so immediately, though I will if there are no meaningful contentions to doing so in the next few days. LevatorScapulaeSyndrome (talk) 20:48, 1 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]

I have received no disagreements so I am now removing it (though it has since been moved out of the introductory text anyhow). LevatorScapulaeSyndrome (talk) 15:06, 20 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Nevermind I lack permissions. Someone else should do it in the mean time. LevatorScapulaeSyndrome (talk) 15:07, 20 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]

It should be added like the text that "the region gained its de facto autonomy in 2012". 77.188.205.179 (talk) 02:20, 22 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Democratic Autonomous Administration of North and East Syria → DAANES – per WP:CONCISE, the current name is too long, and on my Vector 2022 skin, it is taking two lines, making some content a scroll below. The new name would follow the format of articles like UNESCO, UNICEF, etc. 𐩣𐩫𐩧𐩨 Abo Yemen (𓃵) 14:29, 29 March 2025 (UTC) This is a contested technical request (permalink). 𐩣𐩫𐩧𐩨 Abo Yemen (𓃵) 21:00, 29 March 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Support since 60 letters is quite long, though would this name change affect articles like https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constitution_of_the_Democratic_Autonomous_Administration_of_North_and_East_Syria? Asclepias tuberosa (talk) 23:00, 29 March 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Support but have we thought of just Rojava? It is certainly the common name, and gives consistency with Rojava conflict. 🐔 Chicdat  ^{Bawk to me!} 23:38, 29 March 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Wikipedians already went over this years ago. The consensus was no, because Rojava is the Kurdish term for Western Kurdistan whereas the DAANES rules over land not traditionally considered part of Western Kurdistan and if I recall correctly the population the SDF/SDC rules over is in fact majority Arab. The fact the polity itself explicitly prefers DAANES should also be taken account. Sisuvia (talk) 04:34, 30 March 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Against the move. UNICEF and UNESCO are known primarily by their acronyms. I don't think the same can be said here unless you have evidence suggesting otherwise? Personal opinion is that it's fine as it is. Sisuvia (talk) 04:38, 30 March 2025 (UTC)[reply]

• Oppose The use of the name "DAANES" isn't even the common name, AANES English affiliated, Syrian or English media do not use the term "DAANES" in English they use "AANES" see examples like North Press 1. Also using an acronym that is almost never used, and would be a downgrade. Des Vallee (talk) 15:53, 30 March 2025 (UTC)[reply]

  How about moving it to Rojava (Administrative region) or something close to that? 𐩣𐩫𐩧𐩨 Abo Yemen (𓃵) 13:23, 31 March 2025 (UTC)[reply]

@Abo Yemen: I think that would be worse in my opinion than DAANES or AANES. The term "Rojava" only refers to Kurdish majority areas, and shouldn't be used for reasons stated above, especially when it isn't used to refer to the polity but only really parts of the north. In my view the "Democratic Autonomous Administration of North and East Syria" is a decent name even if in my view the "Democratic" does not need to be there. Des Vallee (talk) 15:37, 31 March 2025 (UTC)[reply]

If we are to include "Autonomous Administration" then there's no reason why we should not also include "Democratic", as that is the polity's official title. Otherwise we might as well just name the page North and East Syria. Sisuvia (talk) 16:51, 31 March 2025 (UTC)[reply]

@Sisuvia: As mentioned above however that is not the name used in English, not even by AANES institutions. Des Vallee (talk) 17:12, 31 March 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Also statements by Sisuvia is correct UNESCO and UNICEF are known by their acronym's not by their name. This can't be stated on the AANES/DAANES. As for the length there are longer article titles out there, and two lines doesn't break with formatting. Des Vallee (talk) 15:58, 30 March 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Support alternative move to North and East Syria: Per the argument that @Thespoondragon made in the 2020 requested move for this article. –Gluonz ^{talk contribs} 04:18, 31 March 2025 (UTC)[reply]

@Gluonz You don't think there's a risk of it being too general and confusing as a result? Sisuvia (talk) 16:59, 31 March 2025 (UTC)[reply]

@Sisuvia: Most likely, it would not be confused with any other topic, and this name has significant use in sources per the aforementioned requested-move discussion. –Gluonz ^{talk contribs} 19:32, 2 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

• Oppose - per @Des Vallee's opinion. 🗽Freedoxm🗽(talk · contribs) 05:41, 31 March 2025 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose: As much as a more concise title would be nice, it seems to me, based on the discussion so far, that there isn't one that is precise enough and common enough to be suitable. Cheers, RadiculousJ (talk) 18:43, 31 March 2025 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose: As others have noted, examples like UNESCO & UNICEF fail as a good comparison as sources covering Syria very rarely, if ever, just throw around DAANES as the name of the administration in the Northeast of the country. Furthermore, no wikipedia rule states that just because a title is two lines, or 60 characters, long it is disqualifying. This page is much shorter than many, many other articles (including the world record and others, which I found interesting while searching for applicable wiki rules). While WP:CONCISE policies do favor "brevity" this consideration must be "balanced...with sufficient information to identify the topic to a person familiar with the general subject area." An article name like DAANES fails to take in such a balance in my view. Yeoutie (talk) 23:01, 31 March 2025 (UTC)[reply]

  I would also caution against a move to Rojava, or anything like it, unless the same concerns raised in that move discussion back in 2020 are resolved. Yeoutie (talk) 23:06, 31 March 2025 (UTC)[reply]

• Support move to North and East Syria: the title is a bit chunky as it is for a lot of readers, there does not really even seem to be a consensus on what the name is as I primarily still see AANES online. All news sources in the last week are still showing 'Autonomous Administration of North and East Syria'. Renaming the article North and East Syria simplifies the name, prevents confusion and makes it easier to access - unless we consider a disambiguation page. Ecpiandy (talk) 12:01, 1 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose not a commonly recognizable abbreviation so this is a situation where using the full name is preferable Chessrat ^{(talk, contributions)} 12:16, 1 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose: DAANES is simply not recognisable so it would make little to no sense to change the page name to this. Lord Beesus (talk) 17:29, 2 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose definitely not recognizable, slight support for AANES Waleed (talk) 16:44, 3 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose, we really should be calling this article Rojava instead. I dunno what I am (talk) 23:43, 3 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]