The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: not moved. No support shown (closed by non-admin page mover) – LuniZunie ツ_(talk) 16:48, 3 December 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Template:Sovereign states of Europe → Template:Countries of EuropeTemplate:Countries of Europe – Consistency (WP:TITLECON), credits to PK2 for pointing out a similar issue with the Oceania template. All the other continental templates just say Countries, but for Oceania which is subject to PK2's move request for a similar reason. It would seem oddly paternalistic if only Europe has sovereign States, and the other continents just have countries. Ilvekset (talk) 20:54, 4 November 2025 (UTC) This is a contested technical request (permalink). C F A 22:42, 8 November 2025 (UTC) — Relisting. Jeffrey34555 (talk) 23:08, 15 November 2025 (UTC)[reply]

• I have no opinion on the name of the template, which has retained its page name since Amakuru undid it move back in 2015, citing an even older 2010 RM discussion. Rotideypoc41352 (talk · contribs) 02:15, 7 November 2025 (UTC)[reply]
• It seems that the main headline displayed by the template named "Countries of Europe" is "Countries and dependencies of Europe". I suppose template names are not visible to readers. —⁠ ⁠BarrelProof (talk) 02:36, 7 November 2025 (UTC)[reply]

  Thanks for the ping and yes, I'll contest this one. The 2010 RM discussion had a strong consensus to use "Sovereign states" rather than the less clear "Countries", and this matches the titling on our articles across the project such as List of sovereign states and List of sovereign states and dependent territories in Europe. My suggestion is we standardise on using "sovereign states" for all such templates, to match the titles of the related articles, and avoid the persistent clamouring for England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland to be listed alongside sovereign states since they're all countries.  — Amakuru (talk) 11:45, 7 November 2025 (UTC)[reply]

  @CFA: just wondering why you've started an RM here? The previous RM was quite emphatic on this topic, and nobody's answered my points above. It doesn't seem like there's any case for making a move here and you haven't said why you support it? Cheers  — Amakuru (talk) 15:40, 9 November 2025 (UTC)[reply]

  I don't have an opinion. Just moved it from RMTR since it is clearly controversial. C F A 16:11, 9 November 2025 (UTC)[reply]

  @CFA: if you don't have an opinion then please don't start an RM on the topic. That's a waste of community time. If the OP wishes to start an RM they can do so, but it's up to them to do so and they haven't returned to this thread since it was contested. Cheers  — Amakuru (talk) 18:20, 9 November 2025 (UTC)[reply]

  WP:CIVILITY. @CFA noticed that I brought a move request on the technical moves page but not on the template talk, so @CFA reconciled the gap. No big deal. WP:DONTBITE. As for me, I'm happy to hear multiple solutions that are being discussed that would address the WP:TITLECON problem. Ilvekset (talk) 00:06, 10 November 2025 (UTC)[reply]

• Oppose proposed, instead we should move the others (as another RM) to "sovereign states...", per the main article each template links too, such as List of sovereign states and dependent territories in Oceania, to avoid disputes over what is and isn't a "country" depending on the context. If this one is moved as proposed, there would always be disputes. DankJae 23:48, 8 November 2025 (UTC)[reply]
• Iirc this was part of a large-scale series of moves of similar pages to stop editors adding England, Scotland, and Wales to these sorts of lists they are not appropriate to (and even then there were different views about Northern Ireland). The current title prevents time wasted so there should be an important reason to move. CMD (talk) 02:33, 16 November 2025 (UTC)[reply]