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This assertion ("Academic philosophers do not take the idea of Molyneux as a philosopher seriously.") stated in Wikipedia's voice as if it were an established fact makes little sense. Check who wrote the introduction to Molyneux's book "Against the Gods?: A Concise Guide to Atheism and Agnosticism." - [[Peter Boghossian]]! This is not to say Molyneux would be a prominent philosophical thinker, but I don't think we need such a lecturing of the reader either.[[User:Polska jest Najważniejsza|Polska jest Najważniejsza]] ([[User talk:Polska jest Najważniejsza|talk]]) 00:29, 12 November 2021 (UTC)
This assertion ("Academic philosophers do not take the idea of Molyneux as a philosopher seriously.") stated in Wikipedia's voice as if it were an established fact makes little sense. Check who wrote the introduction to Molyneux's book "Against the Gods?: A Concise Guide to Atheism and Agnosticism." - [[Peter Boghossian]]! This is not to say Molyneux would be a prominent philosophical thinker, but I don't think we need such a lecturing of the reader either.[[User:Polska jest Najważniejsza|Polska jest Najważniejsza]] ([[User talk:Polska jest Najważniejsza|talk]]) 00:29, 12 November 2021 (UTC)

== NPOV Living Person ==


In regards to the treatment of Mr. Molyneux Wikipedia fails today and has failed from inception to be neutral on the subject. Wikipedia would have it that Mr. Molyneux was a fringe personality aka Nebbish in 2009 to the very reincarnation of Adolph Hitler in late 2021!

My suggestion is that a consensus be reached to either 1) remove this entry entirely as Mr. Molyneux is totally irrelevant or 2) correct the neutrality of the entry.

'''From 2009'''

Stefan Molyneux (born 24 September 1966)[1] is a blogger, essayist, author, and host of the Freedomain Radio[2] series of podcasts, living in Mississauga, Canada. He has written numerous articles and smaller essays which have been published on liberty oriented websites such as LewRockwell.com, antiwar.com and Strike The Root, recorded over a 1300 podcasts and written numerous books which all are self-published except for his first which was published by Publish America. In 2006 Stefan Molyneux quit his previous job in the field of computer software to be able to work full-time on Freedomain Radio, a philosophical community website which is completely funded fans of his work through donations and subscriptions of extra media and forum sections.

'''Now in Late 2021'''

Stefan Basil Molyneux (/stəˈfæn ˈmɒlɪnjuː/; born September 24, 1966) is an Irish-born Canadian far-right white nationalist[2][3][4] and white supremacist[5][6] podcaster, blogger, author, political commentator, and banned YouTuber, who promotes conspiracy theories, scientific racism, eugenics, and racist views.[7][8][9][10][11][12] As of September 2020, Molyneux has been permanently banned or permanently suspended from PayPal, Mailchimp, YouTube, Twitter and SoundCloud, all for violating hate speech policies.[13][14][15][16][17]

Molyneux is described as a leading figure of the alt-right movement by Politico and The Washington Post, and as far-right by The New York Times.[18][19][20][21] Tom Clements in The Independent describes Molyneux as "an alt-lite philosopher with a perverse fixation on race and IQ."[22] Molyneux describes himself as an anarcho-capitalist.[18]

Multiple sources describe the Freedomain internet community as a cult, referring to the indoctrination techniques Molyneux has used as its leader.[23][24][25][26]

Revision as of 04:08, 29 December 2021

Template:Annual readership


Could this be a more biased biography of a person — Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.35.240.92 (talk) 01:58, 12 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

It's not at all related. The view is mentioned in the Views section and the Men's rights activism subsection, where it belongs. Firefangledfeathers (talk) 02:03, 12 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Ask the RS that say it, we we do not.Slatersteven (talk) 10:41, 12 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

How is it that the above editor Slatersteven can remove comments from the talk page in addition to controlling the actual wiki article? Why does this one person have so much control over this article? Is it not against the principles of wikipedia?110.174.242.150 (talk) 13:30, 12 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

If you have a complaint about my actions take to eitehr my talk page or wp:ani (I would advise against this), this is not the place to discuss it (see wp:talk.Slatersteven (talk) 13:32, 12 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Rfc to alter the opening sentence in the WP:Lede

WITHDRAWN
There seems to be a consensus established, so the RFC no longer needs to continue. Thanks, everyone for your input. GreenFrogsGoRibbit (talk) 08:17, 14 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

This RFC is to establish Consensus. Do you support the following sentence starting the lede "Stefan Basil Molyneux (/stəˈfæn ˈmɒlɪnjuː/; born September 24, 1966) is an Irish-born Canadian alt-right white nationalist and white supremacist podcaster, blogger, and banned YouTuber, who promotes conspiracy theories, scientific racism, eugenics, and racist views." — Preceding unsigned comment added by GreenFrogsGoRibbit (talk • contribs) 05:10, 14 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]

  • Support Stefan Molyneux is described as alt-right by 9 sources on this page alone, in contrast to only 8 sources charging him as far-right. His affiliation with alt-right politics takes clear precedence over his affiliation with the far-right by the number of sources on this page alone. When I made this change, it was reverted by TucanHolmes as "superfluous", but a superfluous change doesn't require a revert. Something that's unnecessary or pointless is just that, pointless and thus not needed to fix. The other argument was that the next paragraph mentions he is alt-right, but the next paragraph also mentions he is far-right so that fails as a valid justification to warrant a revert. He finally mentions sources describe him as "far-right", but as I said, more sources use the term "alt-right". Mvbaron came in and repeated many of the same points. "because alt-right is repeated below" Yeah, so is the term far-right. "far-right is used in the sources" as is alt-right. He then says my statement that "changing pointless things is pointless" makes no sense. Ok. Please support this change. Thank you. — Preceding unsigned comment added by GreenFrogsGoRibbit (talk • contribs) 05:10, 14 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Grayfell WP:RFCBEFORE does not objectively require discussion before a Wikipedia:Requests for comment, it merely suggests one and it was of my belief that such a discussion would prove meritless so I skipped to consensus building. I didn't think further discussion would result in any of us changing our opinion. GreenFrogsGoRibbit (talk) 07:37, 14 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment: Why is this an rfc? This seems to me like a simple content dispute that doesn't need to be handled by RFC. Also, GreenFrogsGoRibbit, you should include a honest description of the changes. You want to change this:
Stefan Basil Molyneux ... is an Irish-born Canadian far-right white nationalist and white supremacist podcaster, blogger, and banned YouTuber, who promotes conspiracy theories, scientific racism, eugenics, and racist views. ... Molyneux is described as a leading figure of the alt-right movement by Politico and The Washington Post, and as far-right by The New York Times. to
Stefan Basil Molyneux ... is an Irish-born Canadian alt-right white nationalist and white supremacist podcaster, blogger, and banned YouTuber, who promotes conspiracy theories, scientific racism, eugenics, and racist views. ... Molyneux is described as a leading figure of the alt-right movement by Politico and The Washington Post, and as far-right by The New York Times. --Mvbaron (talk) 06:01, 14 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Mvbaron It's an Rfc to avoid edit warring and build WP:Consensus, like every other Rfc on Wikipedia. Rfc main use is for content disputation and to avoid edit-wars. You accuse me of being dishonest, which makes no sense since I am explicit with what I am requesting. You then include your own version of my request which is not any different than what I said earlier. However, in your quote of my request you seem to imply calling him alt-right is redundant as it's mentioned later, but by doing so you leave out the far-right part of the paragraph presumably since including it would prove that far-right is just as redundant. I have included the far-right part omitted after this sentence for others convenience: "and as far-right by The New York Times." GreenFrogsGoRibbit (talk) 07:37, 14 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
GreenFrogsGoRibbit I apologize, I did not mean to imply that you are dishonest, I struck that part above. I also edited the above quotes to accurately reflect what you said. On further reflection, we might actually just remove the "far right" descriptor alltogether from the first sentence, because being white nationalist necessitates that one also is far-right anyways. So I suggest OPTION 2 below: Stefan Basil Molyneux ... is an Irish-born Canadian white nationalist and white supremacist podcaster, blogger, and banned YouTuber, who promotes conspiracy theories, scientific racism, eugenics, and racist views. What do you think about that?--Mvbaron (talk) 08:09, 14 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Mvbaron I'm cool with that. Guess I gotta close down this Rfc now lol. And hey man, everything cool between us. Maybe I should have gone to discussion first. GreenFrogsGoRibbit (talk) 08:12, 14 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose as at best redundant and at worst misrepresenting. The next sentence describes him as alt-right, so removing the far-right descriptor in the first sentence a) is not an improvement because it duplicates content and b) misrepresents the sources which describe him as far-right. --Mvbaron (talk) 06:01, 14 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Support OPTION 2: Stefan Basil Molyneux ... is an Irish-born Canadian white nationalist and white supremacist podcaster, blogger, and banned YouTuber, who promotes conspiracy theories, scientific racism, eugenics, and racist views. --Mvbaron (talk) 08:09, 14 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

THis RFC should not have been closed in less than a day after only two users responded.Slatersteven (talk) 09:33, 14 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]

And not this has been discussed many times, and it has always come down to calling him far-right.Slatersteven (talk) 09:35, 14 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]

This Rfc absolutely can be closed in less than a day pursuant to Wikipedia's own rules. Please see WP:RFCEND: "The question may be withdrawn by the poster (e.g., if the community's response became obvious very quickly). In this situation, the editor who started the RfC should normally be the person who removes the 'rfc' template." I fully complied with the rules here. Sorry. Now for your final point, I have edited this lede many times, I added the "As of September 2020, Molyneux has been permanently banned or permanently suspended from PayPal, Mailchimp, YouTube, Twitter and SoundCloud, all for violating hate speech policies." If I cannot edit the WP:Lede to remove far-right or add alt-right in the first sentence of the lede, then it's time to start a new RFC as far as I am concerned. GreenFrogsGoRibbit (talk) 18:45, 14 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Two people offered opinions, that is not enough to establish a consensus, not after less than 6 hours. Hell many users (as I was) were asleep when you launched and closed this. And (as I said below) you had not included the RFC template, thus it was improperly launched anyway.Slatersteven (talk) 18:50, 14 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Slatersteven Thankfully consensus is not needed to end an RFC. Again, WP:RFCEND says: "The question may be withdrawn by the poster (e.g., if the community's response became obvious very quickly). In this situation, the editor who started the RfC should normally be the person who removes the 'rfc' template." The community response became very obvious, so I ended it which is all that is needed. Consensus is not needed to end an RFC, sorry. GreenFrogsGoRibbit (talk) 19:00, 14 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
I'm not calling him not far-right. What about this? OPTION 3 Stefan Basil Molyneux (...) is an Irish-born Canadian far-right <MOVE NYT AND CNN SOURCES HERE> white nationalist and white supremacist podcaster, blogger, and banned YouTuber, who promotes conspiracy theories, scientific racism, eugenics, and racist views. (...) Molyneux is described as a leading figure of the alt-right movement by Politico and The Washington Post. <REMOVE ", and as far-right by The New York Times."> Mvbaron (talk) 09:40, 14 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
If we must have sources to stop this fine it won't though (and it is already sourced elsewhere in the article, the lede should not really have sources). As I said this has been hashed out many times and keeps getting raised.Slatersteven (talk) 09:43, 14 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Also this RFC failed to include the TRFC tag, and so was incorrectly launched, per WP:RFCST.Slatersteven (talk) 11:13, 14 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Slatersteven If you want a 'rfc|bio' let me know so I can start it. Either way, just like I had to fight to get "As of September 2020, Molyneux has been permanently banned or permanently suspended from PayPal, Mailchimp, YouTube, Twitter and SoundCloud, all for violating hate speech policies." added to this Lede, I am ready for another round with the "far-right" label. Now do you want to start the RFC or shall I? GreenFrogsGoRibbit (talk) 18:48, 14 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
What? policy requires that you put that in, you did not, its not what I want. If you want to launch (a properly launched) RFC go ahead. I think the consensus is clear from all the talk page sections in archives (and above) about this that there is no consensus for your suggested change.Slatersteven (talk) 10:34, 15 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Slatersteven On the contrary, I think there is no consensus or logic established for your stance. Mvbaron Suggestion 2 was the best option shown in our controversy. GreenFrogsGoRibbit (talk) 21:30, 17 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I wish people would bother to check the archives. This had been discussed multiple times. Hell look at the edit history, whenever Far-right is removed it is added back [[1]] [[2]]. Now if we really need an RFC about this fine. But lets not pretend there is no consensus to call him far-right. Now get consensus to change it.Slatersteven (talk) 09:24, 18 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Agree completely with Steven. Forgive me for not checking this page in the blink of an open and shut RfC eye. SPECIFICO talk 13:54, 19 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]

"Academic philosophers do not take the idea of Molyneux as a philosopher seriously. "

This assertion ("Academic philosophers do not take the idea of Molyneux as a philosopher seriously.") stated in Wikipedia's voice as if it were an established fact makes little sense. Check who wrote the introduction to Molyneux's book "Against the Gods?: A Concise Guide to Atheism and Agnosticism." - Peter Boghossian! This is not to say Molyneux would be a prominent philosophical thinker, but I don't think we need such a lecturing of the reader either.Polska jest Najważniejsza (talk) 00:29, 12 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

NPOV Living Person

In regards to the treatment of Mr. Molyneux Wikipedia fails today and has failed from inception to be neutral on the subject. Wikipedia would have it that Mr. Molyneux was a fringe personality aka Nebbish in 2009 to the very reincarnation of Adolph Hitler in late 2021!

My suggestion is that a consensus be reached to either 1) remove this entry entirely as Mr. Molyneux is totally irrelevant or 2) correct the neutrality of the entry.

From 2009

Stefan Molyneux (born 24 September 1966)[1] is a blogger, essayist, author, and host of the Freedomain Radio[2] series of podcasts, living in Mississauga, Canada. He has written numerous articles and smaller essays which have been published on liberty oriented websites such as LewRockwell.com, antiwar.com and Strike The Root, recorded over a 1300 podcasts and written numerous books which all are self-published except for his first which was published by Publish America. In 2006 Stefan Molyneux quit his previous job in the field of computer software to be able to work full-time on Freedomain Radio, a philosophical community website which is completely funded fans of his work through donations and subscriptions of extra media and forum sections.

Now in Late 2021

Stefan Basil Molyneux (/stəˈfæn ˈmɒlɪnjuː/; born September 24, 1966) is an Irish-born Canadian far-right white nationalist[2][3][4] and white supremacist[5][6] podcaster, blogger, author, political commentator, and banned YouTuber, who promotes conspiracy theories, scientific racism, eugenics, and racist views.[7][8][9][10][11][12] As of September 2020, Molyneux has been permanently banned or permanently suspended from PayPal, Mailchimp, YouTube, Twitter and SoundCloud, all for violating hate speech policies.[13][14][15][16][17]

Molyneux is described as a leading figure of the alt-right movement by Politico and The Washington Post, and as far-right by The New York Times.[18][19][20][21] Tom Clements in The Independent describes Molyneux as "an alt-lite philosopher with a perverse fixation on race and IQ."[22] Molyneux describes himself as an anarcho-capitalist.[18]

Multiple sources describe the Freedomain internet community as a cult, referring to the indoctrination techniques Molyneux has used as its leader.[23][24][25][26]

allikas: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special%3ADiff%2F1062550924