Talk:Disinformation in the Russian invasion of Ukraine
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This appears to be a very one sided account, copy of Nato's point of view on the conflict. You should title it Some Russian disinformation according to Nato side.
This appears to be a very one sided account, copy of Nato's point of view on the conflict. At least you should title it Some Russian disinformation according to Nato side. شجاع الدین ضیائیان (talk) 13:07, 21 November 2024 (UTC)
- It's not according to "NATO's side", it's according to independent and reliable sources. — Czello (music) 13:11, 21 November 2024 (UTC)
- Not being favorable to Russia, Ukraine, or any European country more than the other, I am 'the' independent and reliable source.
- Example: Putin announced a Special military operation, Nato side (your 'independent and reliable sources') are calling it: 'Russia invasion of Ukraine'.
- I call it Russia's Special Military Operation in the Donbas (keeping it in quotation marks). That's being independent and reliable. Your sources, your Nato countries sources are not. I call it warmongering against Russia. I call it disinformation because it denies there was a linguistic existential problem in that region, it just erases the problem and implies the only problem is Russia (demonizing it, a necessary tool for warmongering). شجاع الدین ضیائیان (talk) 13:44, 21 November 2024 (UTC)
- You're conflating the "NATO side" with independent and reliable sources. They're not the same - if they were, the sources wouldn't be independent.
- Calling it by Russia's propaganda name is WP:UNDUE and not neutral, even if you put "Russia's" in front of it. — Czello (music) 13:47, 21 November 2024 (UTC)
- You are most definetely not, you are an anonymous Wikipedia editor with a freshly made account seemingly created only to post these comments.
- Given that, per the general sanctions WP:RUSUKR established in this topic, you are permitted to use talk pages such as these to post constructive comments, which I wouldn't say parroting Russian state propaganda falls under.
- You calling the literal invader nation that started the war a victim of warmongering should probably tell us how "independent and reliable" you are. TylerBurden (talk) 20:13, 21 November 2024 (UTC)
- How come this "Russia's Special Military Operation in the Donbas [oblast]" is in Kharkiv, Kyiv, Odesa, Donetsk, Chernihiv, Sumy, Zaporizhzhia, Kherson and Mykolaiv Oblasts to name the most? Mr "independent and reliable source"... Can you provide a source mentioning "linguistic existential problem", anywhere? YBSOne (talk) 15:52, 17 January 2025 (UTC)
- Wikipedia is astroturfed by the State Department and CIA. What do you expect? They arent independent at all. They are selective of which sources they declare "independent" 149.62.208.16 (talk) 12:27, 17 January 2025 (UTC)
- This reminds me, I need to phone up the CIA and ask why I haven't been paid for this month. — Czello (music) 13:02, 17 January 2025 (UTC)
- You push propaganda and lies. Theres tons of fake news coming out of Ukraine and the USA regarding this war. 149.62.208.175 (talk) 11:42, 1 April 2025 (UTC)
- I know but the CIA pay me well for it, so what can I say? — Czello (music) 21:09, 1 April 2025 (UTC)
- But nothing fake coming out of Russia of course, like the super real NATO enginereed mosquitoes. TylerBurden (talk) 21:30, 1 April 2025 (UTC)
- yeah but Russian media is censored from USA, Canada, and I believe all Western countries. How do we even know what they are saying? What is there to repeat when we don't even see what Russia has to say? Snapchat heat maps are also shut off in Ukraine. Why isn't the same happening in Israel or any other war? 2001:56A:734C:DF00:E44D:A684:F113:E73A (talk) 09:33, 9 May 2025 (UTC)
- It's still possible to access Russian media if one wants to, and we know from before the likes of RT were banned that they're propaganda outlets. It would be very odd if they've suddenly changed. — Czello (music) 10:05, 9 May 2025 (UTC)
- No it isn't, people in Western countries can go and listen to lunatics like Vladimir Solovyov making nuclear threats whenever they like, they can also gain perspectives simply from Western media repeating Russian narratives with or without countering them depending on source. In Russia, even stuff like YouTube gets blocked. TylerBurden (talk) 20:16, 9 May 2025 (UTC)
- yeah but Russian media is censored from USA, Canada, and I believe all Western countries. How do we even know what they are saying? What is there to repeat when we don't even see what Russia has to say? Snapchat heat maps are also shut off in Ukraine. Why isn't the same happening in Israel or any other war? 2001:56A:734C:DF00:E44D:A684:F113:E73A (talk) 09:33, 9 May 2025 (UTC)
- You push propaganda and lies. Theres tons of fake news coming out of Ukraine and the USA regarding this war. 149.62.208.175 (talk) 11:42, 1 April 2025 (UTC)
- This reminds me, I need to phone up the CIA and ask why I haven't been paid for this month. — Czello (music) 13:02, 17 January 2025 (UTC)
Accuracy issues and narrative
For an article that purports to discuss disinformation, it is quite ironic that it incurs (intentionally or not) into disinformation dissemination itself. I am making particular reference to the "Allegations of NATO provocation and aggression" subsection where the article mentions the "alleged" promises by NATO countries not to expand the organisation eastwards, and states that no Western diplomat involved at the time corroborate that promise (i.e., it implicitly reduces the argument to Russian narrative fabrication or misinterpretation).
Both are incorrect! We have not only Western diplomats that corroborate the Russian "narrative" (e.g., Jack Matlock Jr., American diplomat that according to himself "participated in the negotiations that ended the Cold War"), but a significant volume of (recently released) documents that attest to the same fact - all Russian leaders since Gorbachev made clear NATO expansion was not to acceptable, and American leaders were so aware of the fact that made commitments and assurances NOT to expand the organisation. These documents were obtained by the National Security Archive, released around 2017 and 2018, and are available for anyone to access - primary sources, first-hand accounts by the main participating players of the time, released and curated by reputable academic institutions.
I find it curious, because during my time as an International Relations student these documents were well-known and debated over during classes, but politicians, the media establishment and society at large seem to have no idea of their existence. To have them be disregarded or dismissed for the sake of sustaining a particular world-view seems disingenuous at best. For the sake of curbing the spread of disinformation, and giving readers a fuller picture, I believe that the paragraph in question should be changed to reflect these sources. As is, it not only misrepresents the facts of history, but funnels the user towards a particular (Western) narrative, which should not be the point of this article (or Wikipedia at large) - no matter your particular stance on this conflict.
Sources/References
For a summarised appreciation of the NSA archives, with additional commentary: https://responsiblestatecraft.org/us-russia-nato/ PingOlin45 (talk) 20:21, 24 November 2024 (UTC)
- This was discussed here already. -- Mindaur (talk) 13:43, 17 December 2024 (UTC)
- And yet nothing was retorted 149.62.208.175 (talk) 11:43, 1 April 2025 (UTC)
- You mean the discussion didn't end the way you wanted it to. TylerBurden (talk) 21:25, 1 April 2025 (UTC)
- And yet nothing was retorted 149.62.208.175 (talk) 11:43, 1 April 2025 (UTC)
Not good enough
This article needs to cover more Ukrainian misinformation there's way more than just the ones cited here like the constant telegram posts about "partisans" pulling Hollywood like sabotage and assassinations without giving any evidence for their existence or the claims that all verified shelling in Donetsk are done by Russia despite the lack of evidence 2A02:587:E83E:542E:146E:59F4:AF6A:898E (talk) 12:08, 4 April 2025 (UTC)
- If you have reliable sources for those. --Hob Gadling (talk) 12:52, 4 April 2025 (UTC)
Proxy war claims
Boris in 2022 https://www.euronews.com/2022/04/26/threat-of-a-nuclear-conflict-should-not-be-underestimated-says-russia-s-top-diplomat
And now he admitted it's proxy war. https://infobrics.org/post/42884
So what is point claiming that claim is propaganda when Boris himself admitted it's proxy war? 5.133.156.37 (talk) 12:44, 3 May 2025 (UTC)
- The source you provided gives information about brics, not about Johnson. Lova Falk (talk) 09:54, 12 June 2025 (UTC)
Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 6 June 2025
Hello. I am requesting that a small change is made under the section that talks about the Crocus City Hall attack. It says that 144 people have been killed however the main article claims that the death toll is 145. I would like the death toll of 144 altered to 145. And in case if you want a source, here is one: [1] ConstructiveCircles (talk) 03:36, 6 June 2025 (UTC)
References
Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 7 June 2025
Change the misleading title from “Disinformation in the Russian Invasion of Ukraine” to “Russian Propaganda in the invasion of Ukraine”.
The current title suggests that the article will talk about all the disinformation that happens in the Russian-Ukrainian war which should be interpreted then with a more neutral stance. However, this article only focuses on disinformation by Russian side and completely ignores propaganda created by the Ukrainian government. To avoid confusion among the readers the title should present this article as a Russian propaganda 70.158.100.161 (talk) 10:32, 7 June 2025 (UTC)
Not done: page move requests should be made at Wikipedia:Requested moves. Day Creature (talk) 14:51, 7 June 2025 (UTC)- I guess you're not reading the same article as everyone else, because this one features an entire section on "Ukrainian themes". TylerBurden (talk) 17:43, 10 June 2025 (UTC)
Citation(s) presumably needed
The last sentence of the lead section:
Descriptions of Ukraine-sponsored propaganda and misinformation have focused on over-optimistic reports about the war and promotion of patriotic stories.
needs to be attributed to reliable sources. The preceding paragraph contains references to several sources, so I assume RS are needed here as well. MilaKuliž (talk) 23:22, 16 June 2025 (UTC)
- Hi MilaKuliž, quite right! I put a cn-tag.Lova Falk (talk) 14:04, 18 June 2025 (UTC)
Why "Disinformation" instead of "Misinformation"?
I saw the article Misinformation in the Gaza war so I was a bit confused as to why this article is named differently. 🐲Jothefiredragon🔥talk🧨contributions✨log🐉 02:16, 29 September 2025 (UTC)
- We follow the sources. When the sources say disinformation, we say disinformation. --Hob Gadling (talk) 15:17, 29 September 2025 (UTC)
- Do "Disinformation" and "Misinformation" have different meaning? Or is it just so happen to be the choice of word in sources¿🐲Jothefiredragon🔥talk🧨contributions✨log🐉 06:40, 8 October 2025 (UTC)
- Disinformation is used more often based on ngrams. Searching for '"Russian disinformation" "Ukraine"' in Google Scholar returns 5,720 hits and for '"Russian misinformation" "Ukraine"' returns 400. The words have different meanings, disinformation implies intentionality, which is obviously present in this case. Kelob2678 (talk) 07:33, 8 October 2025 (UTC)
- "Do "Disinformation" and "Misinformation" have different meaning?" Per the main articles, yes. Disinformation "is content deliberately spread to deceive people, or to secure economic or political gain and which may cause public harm. Disinformation is an orchestrated adversarial activity in which actors employ strategic deceptions and media manipulation tactics to advance political, military, or commercial goals. Disinformation is implemented through coordinated campaigns that "weaponize multiple rhetorical strategies and forms of knowing—including not only falsehoods but also truths, half-truths, and value judgements—to exploit and amplify culture wars and other identity-driven controversies." Misinformation is "incorrect or misleading information" and "can exist with or without specific malicious intent". ... "Susceptibility to misinformation can be influenced by several factors, including cognitive biases, emotional responses, social dynamics, and media literacy levels." With misinformation, there is also an implication that nobody in particular is orchestrating the spread of the misleading information. It may simply be spreading through the usual way for rumors. Dimadick (talk) 08:27, 8 October 2025 (UTC)
- The words differ in terms of intent: dis is intentional; mis may be either unintentional or intentional (so dis is a subset of mis).For the record: following suggestions on another talk page to start off this article, I created this page as Misinformation ...; there was a question posted on this article's talk page asking which term was better (mis vs dis); my summary of the sources favoured dis (intentional rather than unintentional) and I asked if there were objections; and that was on 24 Feb 2022, when two hours was a sufficiently long delay to check for passive consensus in this context of extremely heavy editing and worldwide interest, so I did the move following the lack of objections. Since then, the Dis consensus for this article doesn't seem to have been contested.For the Gaza case, the top of Talk:Misinformation in the Gaza war points you to an RM discussion in October/November 2023 favouring a change from Dis to Mis. If you think that that article has changed enough since November 2023 that it's worth reopening a discussion to change back to Dis, then check the sources and ask over there if others think it's worth considering a change back to Dis. Boud (talk) 17:28, 30 December 2025 (UTC)
- Do "Disinformation" and "Misinformation" have different meaning? Or is it just so happen to be the choice of word in sources¿🐲Jothefiredragon🔥talk🧨contributions✨log🐉 06:40, 8 October 2025 (UTC)
Add study: The Kremlin Connection: Mapping Telegram Networks in Russia, Ukraine, and Belarus
https://telegram-network.openminds.ltd/
OpenMinds explored a network of more than 3,600 political and news-related Telegram channels from Russia, Ukraine, and Belarus, connected by 24,500 links based on audience overlap. It exposes a hidden architecture of influence: pseudo-Ukrainian channels that in reality serve Russian propaganda and primarily target Russian audiences; media from occupied territories systematically folded into a Kremlin-controlled network; or opposition hubs in Russia and Belarus, standing apart from pro-government clusters. Daseyn (talk) 10:04, 17 January 2026 (UTC)
"Allegations of NATO provocation and aggression": "Proxy war claims" incorrect linking
Please change the Vanguard link: "Russia has falsely asserted several times that Ukraine is not a sovereign country, but its government is controlled by foreign powers whose companies, banks and investment funds like BlackRock or Vanguard control a large portion of Ukrainian soil and forbid to bury Ukrainian corpses below it."
Vanguard links to the attack formation rather than the Vanguard group it appears to be referencing: The Vanguard Group JordyGrey talk 23:47, 12 February 2026 (UTC)
- Fixed, thanks! LordCollaboration (talk) 00:19, 13 February 2026 (UTC)
Title
A couple editors went on a whole spree moving articles like this to titles including the Russo-Ukrainian war following the move that took place on what is currently Russo-Ukrainian war (2022–present) but seem to have missed this one.
Obviously the article covers more than what the Wikipedia consensus determined to be the "invasion phase", so should we move it for the sake of consistency?
"Disinformation in the Russo-Ukrainian war" for example. TylerBurden (talk) 16:20, 27 February 2026 (UTC)
- Seems an uncontroversial move to me. Lova Falk (talk) 11:06, 1 March 2026 (UTC)
- Agreed. -- Mindaur (talk) 12:27, 1 March 2026 (UTC)
- Thanks for the input both, it seems like only an administrator can move it. TylerBurden (talk) 17:33, 2 March 2026 (UTC)
- I have posted a move request on WP:RMTR. TylerBurden (talk) 17:46, 2 March 2026 (UTC)
- Thanks for the input both, it seems like only an administrator can move it. TylerBurden (talk) 17:33, 2 March 2026 (UTC)






