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http://www.ancient-bulgaria.com/images/Thracian_something.jpg

http://www.ancient-bulgaria.com/images/Thracian_horseman_on_hunt.jpg

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The exact quote from Xenophanes goes "The Ethiopians say that their gods are flat-nosed and black skinned, while the Thracians say that theirs have blue eyes and red hair. Yet if cattle or horses or lions had hands and could draw and sculpt like men, then the horses would draw their gods Like horses, and cattle like cattle, and each would shape the body of Gods in the likeness of each kind, of their own." Now he says that the Thracians have red hair and blue eyes and in such a way too mark it as common as the black skin of Ethiopians. This can't be completely dismissed surely? Either he was lying to his audience who would have seen straight through him being well acquainted with the appearance of Thracians, or the Thracians worshiped red headed gods, which again doesn't make sense as the point Xenophanes is making is that we make gods to look like ourselves. The last explanation is that there were a fair number of red haired blue eyed Thracians. umm no thracians worshiped dark haired dark eyes gods u see that guy with the axe??that was there most supreme god which means they made him in there own image.they could not see stratigh tru his lie because most greeks have never seen thracians.and another wrongess of thise theory is that ethiopians are the most unsnubed nosed people of the aficans alot of ethiopians are straith nosed showing semetic simmilarity.xenopahnes was probably mislead about the dsicreptions of thracian gods like orpheus,dionsysus,ares wich were corupted by greek histortorians who were acelly PHILOSOPHERS the thracians always decipted in ancient greek art as being dark haired and eyed.and the thracian murals wich where done by thr thracians decept them as dark haired and eyed people with a browned haired minority.but still with a dark/olive skinned compleixion.how about we let the ACTUAL THRACIANS DECIDE WHAT THEY LOOKED LIKE INSTEAD OF A POET/PHILOSOPHER.and also the findiand of academic research on thracians wich show them to have hight consetrations of millinia in upper derma and around iris area wich means they were dark complexiod with dark eyes.with thise evidence from both ancient and modern information we can surly dismiss thise misleading.also if they had a large ammount of red haired people herodoctus would have surley noted on that yet another point wich proves the idea of fair thracians as a lie.thracians surley looked like the hunter murals that THEY have drawn what u think they drew the wrong people???most thracians were accely aboriginal people of southern europe and anotolia. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.197.196.156 (talk) 09:53, 4 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

The murals are interesting, but we're not supposed to engage in original research here on anything, including what the Thracians looked like, so can we have a citation of an academic paper of this research? As far as I understand for instance the Greeks depicted women and men with different pigments, and this probably does not actually depict their actual skin color realistically. Some academic research into this matter would make for a better reference than to ask people to judge for themselves. If multiple different opinions of the way the Thracians look exist which both have a notable following, we should represent each of them in the article, not just one. It appears from your debating it here that there's not exactly a consensus view. Martijn Faassen 22:59, 23 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

look martijn i khow ur trying to stop the argueing so i will keep my opinion in aslong as other people will. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.227.172.119 (talk) 06:43, 25 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I'm not sure what you mean by that. I just want to make sure the article reflects current scientific reality, and links to murals and judging for ourselves aren't going to make sure of that. What we need to is to get some good academic sources on this. If there is a difference of opinion in academia, the article should reflect that. Martijn Faassen 12:21, 25 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

ya but we do have good scientific evedince because anthropologist have tested thracian remains and have found them to have hight malanin in both iris and upper derma that means that thracians were mostly black haired and dark eyed — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.227.172.119 (talk) 20:29, 26 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Citations please? Let's put citations to this anthropological research in the article. The murals are at most an illustration. They're not great evidence by themselves for the reasons I pointed out. Martijn Faassen 22:35, 30 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

the murals just sopport thise ansewere and the idea of fair thracians is almsot not sopported by anythign but that passsage from Xenophanes and since u allready confiremed that greeks used difffrent pigment for women and man but in reallity it was not thise way. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.227.172.119 (talk) 20:29, 26 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

This is an original conclusion by you, right? Did the greeks generally make up skin coloration when writing about peoples? I just talked about an example of how murals may not give an accurate idea of skin color by themselves because of artistic conventions. A modern comic strip also often doesn't give a very accurate representation of people's skin color. Martijn Faassen 22:35, 30 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

i have allready given an explanation why thise philosopher Xenophanes would say that is because many GODS that were considered thracian gods were corupted by greeks and turned into there own version and since greeks taught that ALL northerns were read haired and blue eyed they probably made there gods look thise way.but in reallity it was not thise way because the guy with the double headed axe is god of thracians and look the way they descibed him black haired and very dark eyed with olive darkish skin. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.227.172.119 (talk) 20:29, 26 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Your explanation is interesting, but if that is your original idea, it doesn't belong in wikipedia. If it comes from another source, please give us a source and we can quote it in the article. So far the only sources I heard of are Xenophanes, who says they were fair, and the murals, which can be used as interpretations they're dark, but can also have other interpretations. The anthropological research would be extremely helpful in making things more clear. Martijn Faassen 22:35, 30 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

The thracians were red haired and blue eyed as described by contemporaries. The citation of Cohen's merely asserts without evidence. I have actually read it. Heavenly horseman (talk) 02:30, 26 July 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Recessive genes don't hold up when racial makeup disrupted for nearly one thousand years of Asiatic, Ottoman, and Gypsy invasions The Asiatic invasions and their consequences are detailed in other chapters—suffice to say here that they included the armies of Attila the Hun, the Avars, Bulgars, and Magyars. But behold Beth Cohen. She knows better than ancient people and their lying eyes. I'm sure she has no ulterior motive at all 2604:2D80:E406:DA00:A8DD:D35A:1E1B:5D51 (talk) 22:57, 19 May 2025 (UTC)[reply]

At religion section Thracians#Religion it states; "The Thracians are considered the first to worship the god of wine called Dionysus in Greek or Zagreus in Thracian. Later this cult reached Ancient Greece." while archaeology has let us know; The earliest written records of Dionysus worship come from Mycenaean Greece, specifically in and around the Palace of Nestor in Pylos, dated to around 1300 BC. see Kerényi, Karl. 1976. Dionysus. Trans. Ralph Manheim, Princeton University Press. ISBN 0691029156, 978-0691029153. Also "recent evidence has shown that Dionysus was in fact one of the earliest gods attested in mainland Greek culture" see Isler-Kerényi, Cornelia; Watson, Wilfred G. E. (2007). "An Iconography in Process". Dionysos in Archaic Greece. Brill. pp. 5–16. 2A02:587:5456:E000:29EB:6655:B43D:990E (talk) 12:30, 23 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]